Position:Home>Philosophy> Do people who only support free will and don't believe determinism really kn
Question: Do people who only support free will and don't believe determinism really know what determinism is about!?
I'm a strict determinist just because i've never seen any contradiction between determinism and free will!. i believe they're both true, but free will doesn't seem to include determinism
it seems like all determinism theory supporters also believe in free will because they bother to notice that the two don't contradict
at the most simple level a person can make his own decision!. he can choose to decide WHAT ever he wants to!. he has free will!. determinism just says that with enough information of the person's past, we can predict his decision!. decision are undoubtedly affected by moods and past experiences!. take all that into account and you can predict a person's decision
imagine using a time machine to travel back!. wouldn't you see history repeating itself, and people making the same decisions!? assuming this is obvious to everyone, this is the most solid proof of determinism in my opinion!. a world without determinism wouldnt make sense
there's no contradiction!. anyone disagree!?Www@QuestionHome@Com
Best Answer - Chosen by Asker:
As usual with philosophical issues, much comes down to how you define your terms!. If your version of "Determinism" is something like "If you know a person very well you can predict which choice he or she will make!.!.!." or anything of that sort, then of course that is compatible with free will!.
However, that is not how most people define determinism, and with the traditional definition, it does indeed contradict the traditional definition of free will!. Here's how!.
Philosophers define a Deterministic universe as one in which each and every event occurs in the way it does because of the antecedent conditions!. In other words, the way things are set up at "Time 1" plus the laws of physics equals the outcome of the event!.
For example, take a pool table!. Imagine the balls spread around randomly with the cue near the middle!. The striking of the cue is the only variable, and after that energy has been introduced to the system, everything that happens after that is purely "Determinisitc"!. If someone knew everything about the laws of physics, the friction of the balls, their weight, the slant of the table etc!., they could predict, from that information plus the information about the cueball strike, exactly which balls would end up in which pockets and where on the table the others would end up!.
That is determinism!. The hypothesis that the entire universe works in exactly the same way as that pool table, which includes all human beings!. It isn't usually looked at on the level of people and history, as you set your question up, but rather on the level of Physical Particles and Physical Laws!. If human beings are made up of material which follows physical laws, they never really make a free choice, it only looks that way to us because we can never have all the information!.
That's where Chaos Theory comes in (as one of your other answerers alluded to)!. Chaos theory (with its cousin complexity theory) says that not only do we not have the ability to know all the information, it is literally impossible to have it all!. They say the free will/determinism debate cannot be settled empirically because it is "intractable"!. But I suppose that is beside the point!.
The point is, in order to say that Free Will and Determinism are compatible, you have to change the definitions in some way!. If you define the terms in the traditional way that philosophers have, both cannot be true!. Hope that clears things up a bit for you!Www@QuestionHome@Com
I agree they don't contradict, but I wouldn't explain it the same way!. I agree that if we could objectively know the future, past, and present equally well, determinism would appear true!. Which of course, we can't, by our very nature -- we are never experiencing the past nor the future; they are relatively unknown to us!. We experience the present, so free will is true for us!. The whole controversy is moot, absurd, irrelevant!.Www@QuestionHome@Com
Determinism is defined as "The teaching that every event in the universe is caused and controlled by natural law!." this is clearly opposite the theory of free will that says we make our own environment based on the choices at hand!.Www@QuestionHome@Com
Computers were invented to predict the weather!. Then they realized there were so many variables it was impossible!.
Thats the same with human decision making!. There are so many variables that you can never predict the choice with any more accuracy than you could predict the weather!.Www@QuestionHome@Com
You would have to ask someone who thought that way!.
But both free will and determinism are flawed concepts as you can arrive at contradictions if either is assumed!.Www@QuestionHome@Com
Okay!. What "frees" my will!?
Stop pretending to be a determinist and confusing people!.Www@QuestionHome@Com
Doesn't matter to me, because it's not important!. What happens, happens!.Www@QuestionHome@Com
Your problem is your like the rest of us, as very few of us have a solid black and white view on things!. Completely Deterministic people, however, from what I know of them, all believe that when someone makes a decision, that decision was already going to be made so it, in fact, was not their decision at all and with that, it was also in no way "free!."
I personally believe that this whole world is one big experiment!. There is no knowing as to what anyone will do until they do it!. This puts a lot more weight on our shoulders because we know that our decisions aren't just being sent through us by some sort of greater physical law that we all abide and basically act upon every day!. If the world was in fact deterministic and everyone knew it, then nothing would ever get done because everyone would know that whatever they did was already planned and set in stone!.Www@QuestionHome@Com