Position:Home>History> Why is France looked on as cowards by the USA?

Well, first of all, your question is incorrect!. The USA as a whole of its citizens doesn't look upon the French nation or the French people or the French Army as cowards!. The USA Government doesn't look upon them in that way either!.

SOME Americans believe that SOME French people and SOME French Leaders are more interested in protecting their own derrierres then fighting the evils of the world!. Evidence of this is the French actions before World War 2 broke out in refusing to enforce the Versailles Treaty and preventing Hitler from building up his military, from taking over Austria, Sudetenland, and Czechoslovakia!. In addition, the French performance in WW2 was not very good, especially their leadership!. The best of French troops, along with the BEF, moved into the low countries to defend them against the German attack, which then were cut off by the German attack through the Ardennes!. After that, the French leaders capitulated!.

French assistance in the Revolutionary War was more monetary than military and the military actions that the contributed to most was for their own benefit in gaining colonies in other parts of the world than assistance in American battles!.

As for a listing of most powerful militaries in the world, I would say that it would be:

1) US;
2) UK;
3) Russia, China, Germany;
6) French

Russia and China have massive armies, but can't pretend to have a navy in comparison!.

whale

One of the best "french" jokes is about "Why are all French roads lined with Trees; so that the German troops can march in the shade!"

@ Austerlitz

-there were mutineries in all countries that were involved in the war, not only among the French army!.

FALSE

-Yes France was very tough to German and once again how can you judge them !? This is not your country, if you had had your villages destroyed, and 1400 000 die, 4 266 000 injured, which makes millions of widows and orphans, and knowing that the Germans just behind the border were ready to come back at any moment you would have reacted the same way!.

FALSE, in fact, the US treaty ending the war with Germany was much less harsh and the US eventually cancelled the debt owed by Germany!.

-The whole Europe prefered appeasement against Hitler and not only the French, and when you see how terrible WWI had been you can understand hat nobody wanted to live another war!.

FALSE - Austria, Czechloslovakia and Poland didn't want to appease Hitler they wanted to fight, but the French and the British refused to live up to their treaty guarantees, even then Poland lasted longer with horse cavalry against Germany than France did with tanks!.

You talk about the Foreign Legion!.!.!. and do you think that the troops who landed in France in 1944, the aviators of the RAF were only British or Americans !? There were people from all over the world, France, Polen, etc!.

The Free French and the Free Polish and other Free forces were only a miniscule portion of the Allied militaries!.

Anyway this kind of fight has nothing to do with what the French resistants did!. When you drop bombs over a country, your airplane can crash and you can die!. When you were a Résistant in France, you could be arrested, tortured (and in this case you would be happy to die quickly) , and your family too (no your family was not safe at home)!.

The French resistance was only a small fraction of the population of France, the VAST majority either wanted to be left alone or were actual collaborators with the Nazis!.

But I see French bashing is very trendy among some people!.!.!.

I am sorry, and the French people don't ever bash anyone else, the Americans in particular!?

that's a shame, if the surrendering of Pétain (1 person) is a proof to you that the French are cowards,

I didn't say that, but Petain was the head of government and the whole government surrendered, not just Petain!.

the French Résistance ( a minority, you'll say !?!?!? at least more than 1 person) should prove you that the French are gallant!. See how Jean Moulin died, see what happened in Bir-Hakeim, see what happened in Verdun and you should be ashamed of telling that the French are "cowards"!.

The action of one person does not and can not reflect upon the others, you treat all people the same, the way in which their actions deserve them to be treated!.

@nigel 101 :do you really think the americnas took part in the war just to save France !?!?!? if so, they would have done in in 1940 and not only after the attack of Pearl Harbor!. They fought in France to defeat the nazis and would have done it even if the whole population had wanted them to leave the country!. It has nothing to do with generosity or sacrifice!. They fred France to beat the nazis and not to free the French, so don't say they fought for the French, they fought for themselves and nothing more!.

The FACT remains that by defeating Hitler, the Allies freed France, Belgium, Holland, Italy, Poland, et al from Nazi control!.

But your answer proves me I'm right, french bashing everywhere!.!.!. When I read such silly and biased thinks I'm glad not to be one of those foreigners!.

Your answer proves that you are either not knowledgeable about history or are so jingoistic that you are unwilling to admit to the truth!. Not that French people are all cowards, but that some are!. In the same way, NOT all Americans are brave and pure, which proves that stereotyping all of a certain group in a certain way is false and idiotic!.

Source(s):
I'm French and proud of it!. And won't let anyone tell lies just to despise my fatherland!. My 2 grandfathers fought during WWI, especially in Verdun, 2 others ancestors were killed during WWI!. So take your "cowards" back!.

The performance of your grandfathers only reflects upon them, their service does not make you, or anyone else more or less brave, each man stands upon his own actions!.Www@QuestionHome@Com

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Some Americans think the French are cowards because they didn't want to get involved in the war against Iraq!. Even though Saddam had no connection to al Qaeda and the 9/11 attacks, some Americans still believe that the war in Iraq started as a war against terrorism!.
Personally, I think that France was right not to follow the Americans!. All the American arguments for the war in Iraq turned out to be false!.Www@QuestionHome@Com

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Because they for the most part of the past 100 years have been stuck on themselves!.

If it was not for us they'd still be under Nazi domination!. The fools!.

And our tax dollars went to them to help them rebuild their country when they fought so poorly and surrendered so readily!. Www@QuestionHome@Com

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They just recently haven't been involved in any wars but instead voice their opinion then reap the benefits of the American blood shed (most recently in Iraq)!. That's the major cause of the stereotype!.Www@QuestionHome@Com

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NO, I have never thought of the French as cowards, but just extremely rude people ! I have been to France several times ( U S Navy ),and I think it is a really crappy place ! ( Next in line: Canada ) !!!Www@QuestionHome@Com

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Economic performancedoes not make any nation un-cowardly, it doesn't imply bravery!.

I can't speak for Americans, but I believe there is a general dislike of the lateness of the French help for the American revolution (despite saying they would help more)!. There is also the fact that the French assistance was more to hurt Britain than out of genuine concern for the Americans or their cause, "my enemy's enemy is my friend", Washington himself had spent years fighting the French in North America!.

There seems to be a very different idea between Anglo-Saxons and mainland Europeans!.
I don't think a country fighting in battles on their home territory in their defence could be considered "heroic"!. Don't get me wrong, the individual soldier fighting is good, but you don't honestly expect non-French people to congratulate a nation on defending itself when the Americans were fighting thousands of miles away to protect French freedom!. And the British were fighting on three fronts (four if you count fighting in Italy), during World War One!.

There most certainly were not mutinies in all countries in all armies during the first world war, that is a tremendous lie!. There were mutinies in France, Germany (mainly civilians who had been on near starvation diets for two years, this defeatism spread into the army), Russia (even worse conditions), there were also mutinies in the Italian army (general dissatisfaction between the peasants and the officers, combined with the failures of the Italian heriarchy and state at integration into one state!.)
There weren't mutinies in the British or American armies!. There weren't mutinies at the battle of the somme where the British suffered 100,000 casualties on the first day alone, trying to take pressure of the French fighting at Verdun!.

Now before the second world war there was a concensus that appeasement was the best policy!. I'm not saying that was cowardise, afterall the British government had to twist the arm of the French government to accept the Munich agreement, and there was the famous Neville Chamberlain "peace in our time" moment!.

However, the French surrendered!. I don't think you realise just what kind of an impact this leaves on people still fighting!.
It has been argued that a country facing the casualties of thousand or hundreds of thousand of deaths by a neighbour would act the same!.
Russia didn't do this, they lost twenty MILLION people in ww2, they kept fighting over 4 long and arguous years, brining themselves bask from the brink of extinction, it's believed (no one really knows) that ten million chinesse people died because of the Japanesse invasion!.

This would (and is by many today) seen as a betrayl!. If you're not fighting them you're helping them!.
If a person in't willing to defend themselves then surely that is the definition of cowardice!. Areas of France were handed over by the French government, in full knoweldge that they would be used to attack Britain, surely that is betrayl!. Not to mention all the servicemen who would die to free France, when the french army was unwilling to fight to the last to defend it's own homeland!.

The Free French!? They didn't liberate France, not by a long shot!. How many beaches were there at D-Day!? Gold Beach (British landing), Sword Beach (British landing, with free french commandos), Omaha Beach (American landing), Juno Beach (Canada/British landing), Pointe du Hoc (American landing), and Utah Beach (American landing)!.

Do you seriously think the Free French could have succedded without the British and Americans!? Who supplied the guns, weapons, uniforms, transport!? The British and Americans paid for it all!.

The RAF wasn't only Brits (for future reference the American REPUBLIC did have it;s own air arm, the Army Aiforce), it did have squadrons of foreign pilots!. But saying the RAF was a big diversity of nationalities is like saying the French army is because of the Foreign Legion!. Predominately British!.

A fighter pilot is flying over enemy territory to fight, whereas a member of the resitance was fighting in his homeland!.
It's like saying a man woh defends his home is more heroic than someone who walks over the street to defend someone elses!.
Your family wasn't safe!. Of course no British civilians died in the war, there weren't massive air raids (over 600,000 civilians died this way) whereas there were less than half that amount of civilian deaths in France!.

Petain was a VERY old man, do you honestly balme the entire surrender on him!? His government supported it, there was a scramble for position in the new government!. How many people collaborated!?
You say the French resitance proves otherwise, of course there were numerous individuals who did fight from the beginning to the end!. However most of the people in the French resitance in 1944/5 had joined only after it became obvious Germany was going to lose the war, oppurtunistic you could say!. Many people in France did the same, some Vichy officWww@QuestionHome@Com

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Mostly the reputation of the French as cowards comes from the WWII defeat to the Germans!. It has been oddly re-enacted during the 2002 march to the second Gulf War for less-than clean reasons!.

But it has to be said that the American vision of the French cowardice is not wrong, but not for the reasons that are usually put forward!.

France did surrender quickly, and actually it was dragged into the war by the UK, they were ready to give up Poland!.

But what has to be said is the fact that WWI was a total Phyrric victory!. The country lost over a million young men in four years, another million was so badly hurt they could never work anymore!. A fifth of the country had been devastated!. The whole gold reserve had been shipped away!. In one word: the world the population used to live in had be destroyed!. On top of that, a demographic reaction to the war had diminish the fertility rate to non-renewal of generation levels!.

To get an idea, consider the state the US would be in if instead of 300,000 young men it had lost between 15 and 20 million in Viet Nam!. Followed by a demographic slump that would mean that the 2008 population of the US would be closer to 300 million than 400!.

Once more think about the difficulty the US faced after Vietnam when it comes to put their soldiers into arms way!. Think about the fact that the URSS after the WWII catastrophe did not get involved in a single armed conflict before 1979!. The same goes for Japan and Germany, their commitment to pacifism mostly steams from the terrible tole of WWII on both these countries!.

On the other hand countries that have emerged victorious and relatively unarmed from an armed conflict are way more gun-ho!. The same way, "young" countries (i!.e!. high fertility rate and low average age) tend to be way more bellicose than "old" ones!.

Finally, whereas the Finns had proved that a small yet motivated army could repeal a big one, it is interesting to remark that for their first encounter with the Panzer neither the French, nor the Poles, nor the Belgians, nor the Greeks, nor the Yougoslavians, nor the Russian, nor the Dutch, nor indeed the Brits (remember Dunkirks) nor the Americans (remember Kasserine) could resist!. The German were just too strong and the French did not enjoy the type of strategic depth the Russians had at their disposal!.

IIRC, the French Army lost over 100,000 men (KIA) in one month and many surrendered because they were ordered so!. The German even allow the Army Group C leave their fortresses with their flags and their weapons in testimony of their courage after a month-long siege!.

What is really a stain to the French honour is what happened after the invasion!. Not only did the majority of the politicians refuse to keep on fighting from the Empire and overseas but they also accepted the destruction of the French republic and democracy their men had fought and died for and only a very small percentage of the population decided to go on fighting against the nazis and for freedom!. Thousands of Jews were arrested by French police, millions co-operated with the occupying forces!. That's where the French cowardice lays!.

Although, I'm not sure that the US should seize the moral high ground so quickly!. I mean Jim Crow wasn't French was he!? I guess the only real thing you could reproach the French has be to react according to human nature not as a bunch of selfless heroes!.Www@QuestionHome@Com

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@ lakewood C :

-there were mutineries in all countries that were involved in the war, not only among the French army!. And how can you judge, you just don't know what hell it was!.

-Yes France was very tough to German and once again how can you judge them !? This is not your country, if you had had your villages destroyed, and 1400 000 die, 4 266 000 injured, which makes millions of widows and orphans, and knowing that the Germans just behind the border were ready to come back at any moment you would have reacted the same way!.

-The whole Europe prefered appeasement against Hitler and not only the French, and when you see how terrible WWI had been you can understand hat nobody wanted to live another war!.

-I don't really know what "betrayals" you are talking about!.

You talk about the Foreign Legion!.!.!. and do you think that the troops who landed in France in 1944, the aviators of the RAF were only British or Americans !? There were people from all over the world, France, Poland, etc!.
Anyway this kind of fight has nothing to do with what the French resistants did!. When you drop bombs over a country, your airplane can crash and you can die!. When you were a Résistant in France, you could be arrested, tortured (and in this case you would be happy to die quickly) , and your family too (no your family was not safe at home)!.
But I see French bashing is very trendy among some people!.!.!. that's a shame, if the surrendering of Pétain (1 person) is a proof to you that the French are cowards, the French Résistance ( a minority, you'll say !?!?!? at least more than 1 person) should prove you that the French are gallant!. See how Jean Moulin died, see what happened in Bir-Hakeim, see what happened in Verdun and you should be ashamed of telling that the French are "cowards"!.

@nigel 101 :
-do you really think the americnas took part in the war just to save France !?!?!? if so, they would have done in in 1940 and not only after the attack of Pearl Harbor!. They fought in France to defeat the nazis and would have done it even if the whole population had wanted them to leave the country!. It has nothing to do with generosity or sacrifice!. They fred France to beat the nazis and not to free the French, so don't say they fought for the French, they fought for themselves and nothing more!.

-You say there were no mutineries in the american army!. Fortunately !! because the Americans entered the war in 1917 (the year of mutineries in others countries) so they had not already 3 years of war behind them, so if they had reacted like those who were in this case!.!.!.

-And according to you the only bravery is when you fight for another country !?!?!? but in this case bravery doesn't exist because why do you think you choose one side or another if not to defend your interests !? don't be naive!. Even if these interests can force you to fight aside with another country!.

-"if you don't fight them you help them"!. So all the neutral countries, Swiss, Spain, Portugal and so on were cowards too !?!? they won't like it!.

-Pétain was very old and that's why he can't have make the decision alone , you say !? well, you haven't understand anything, Pétain's age was the problem!. Do you know he wasn't the chief of the government before the beginning of the war !? So if fate had wanted Géneral De Gaulle to rule France instead of Pétain, all the French would have been the bravest, but just because it was Pétain they are all cowards !? Don't melt the government and the people please!.

To finish you could assume your ideas and tell me what's your nationality, except if you have something you could be blamed for!.

But your answer proves me I'm right, french bashing everywhere!.!.!. When I read such silly and biased thinks I'm glad not to be one of those foreigners!.
2 hands down for my answer !? because I'm just breaking some myths and telling some annoying truths!.!.!.Www@QuestionHome@Com

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1!. In WWI, there was a mutiny in the French army!.

2!. After the war, the French, like vicious cowards, insisted on
saddling Germany with unrealistic reparations (whose major
effect was, in fact, to cripple Germany and pave the way for
the rise of the Nazis)!.

3!. In the 30s, they preferred appeasement to resisting Hitler's
territorial demands!.

4!. At the beginning of WWII, they held out against the Germans
for one month before quitting!

5!. During the years it looked as though the Germans would win,
as many Frenchmen enlisted in the SS as joined the fabled
Resistance!.

6!. After the war, France performed a series of betrayals --
its troops in Indochina, its settlers in Algeria!.!.!.!.

7!. During this period, too, perhaps its best military unit was
non-French (the Foreign Legion)!.

8!. In recent times, France has consistently and cravenly sided
with Muslims against Israel and the U!.S!.


Www@QuestionHome@Com

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Britain was attack attacked by Germany in WWII London was hit hard by V2 rockets!. They are seen as cowards because they surrendered to the Germans without "firing a shot!." They pretty much allowed them to walk right in when they had walls and fortresses that were heavily armed!.

Uhm Actually the Free French was actually an Auxiallary to the British Royal Navy, an auxiallary!.!.!.meaning they were a small piece!. and De gaulle was just a puppet under Winston Churchhill!. So there goes your Free French Theory!. I guess you dont know what D-Day is!? That doesnt ring a bell!.!.!.the beaches of Normandy!? The march to paris!? And as far as Nam that is not the USA, we did not open our doors to foreign troops to waltz right into the country!.Www@QuestionHome@Com

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