Will someone send me in the right direction?

Question: Will someone send me in the right direction!?

Befuddled smile!. Can one critique a poem properly if still learning even the basics of poetry!? Is there a site that shows about critiquing poetry or is that something I will pick up as I learn more about rhythm and meter and such!. Thank you!.Www@QuestionHome@Com

Best Answer - Chosen by Asker:

My dear lady, you have asked a most pertinent question that deserved full and thoughtful responses; some you have received are exactly that!. You wish to know if it is possible to render qualified literary criticism sans specific training; my qualified answer, such as it must be, is that your opinion will be as valuable as the fount of knowledge from which it is drawn, exactly as deep and exactly as sustaining!. If you do not understand the intricacies of meter -- know what trochee and anapest mean, for example -- how will you be able to describe what your ear may, or may not, perceive!? If you do not understand the elements arrayed along the continuum of trope, how will you understand how the poet has crafted her comparison, and for what reason!? If you are untrained in rhetorical device, how will you know when hyperbaton has been used, to cite one of your examples, and for what purposes it, specifically, was chosen!. If you do not understand something of phonology and the IPA and speech production, how will you understand the phonemic choices made by the poet, and towards what end they were made!? How are your difficulties to be resolved: study!. You will need to do many things, and thankfully reading and writing poetry are central amongst them!. You should also read some good books wherein you can learn, say, rhetorical devices by description and example, for example Richard Lanham's "Handbook of Rhetorical Devices"; I can't properly teach them all to you here (I know a couple hundred intimately), but let me tell you that hyperbaton is any intended deviation from ordinary word order: "Arms and the man I sing" (Virgil) or "Whom God wishes to destroy, he first makes mad" (Euripides)!. It is a common strategy in poetry, employed for any number of reasons, often ones as prosaic as improving meter!. Turco is good, as far as he goes!. Try also "A Poet's Guide to Poetry" by Mary Kinzie!. For the sounds of poetry, there are useful books by Robert Pinsky and Mary Oilver; they aren't tomes, but they contain useful insights!. From these books, you can also learn about the continuum of trope (especially Kinzie)!. As for phonology and scientific linguistics, I don't like any that I've run across as they relate to poetic sound effects!. You must also read poetry, lots of it, of all types, all forms!. Pick a favorite or ten, gradually learn to recite their best works aloud, and concentrate on interpreting them with your voice!. Better yet, memorize the poems, fully internalize them, make them part of who you are, let them guide you!. When you write, the more you know, the more you have to bring to your own poetry, and the better it will be!. Like most things in life that we learn to value and desire, work and persistence are necessary!. The love of learning is the surest hallmark of wisdom, because you have bowed your head and engaged in the prayerful act of making your life, your poetry, what it is meant to be!. I apologize for my brief and inarticulate words, but so much remains to be done!. I have, incidentally, read some of your poetry, and I would not have answered your question if I had not seen a value in what you have to say, in your gift!. Yes, this was five minutes well spent!.!.!.Www@QuestionHome@Com

Love, An Honest Man has given you golden wisdom in these matters; to respond to a hairless declaimer who pollutes our page, I would like to point out that AHM is a level 6 with over 13,000 points!. But at one time, he was just beginning here, as we all did!. Unlike our declaimer, he is articulate, not some tar-tongued illiterate who knows not the difference between "there" and "they're," as our declaimer is by all appearances!. You see, it isn't a matter of time here, or points accumulated!. AHM is educated, a professor of mathematics; I was a student of his, and frankly his mind terrifies and intrigues me all at once!. Our declaimer I doubt has an IQ more than half of the one he so pointedly dismisses; he looks at an articulate response, four of them moreover, and dismisses them because in them he sees his own face reflected, a face without the seasoning of a worldly and educated man, a face so contorted with rage that it cannot even comprehend that it has become that way because of self-hatred fueled by envy of his betters, a face eating a banana!. Love, don't feed the animals!. Www@QuestionHome@Com

You can always critique because poetry has no right or wrong!. So if you just write what is in your head then its good!. As long as you think so!. As for a site, well, there may be some for general poetry ideas and if you search for meters and technique then you should be on your way!.

Hope that gives you some info but if youd like some more feel free to message me at lobsterhickman@yahoo!.comWww@QuestionHome@Com

Sorry, Sin, I am not a scholar on the art of poetry, so I can't help you!.
I usually just comment on the content, whether it touched me, derived a reaction, and if so, what that reaction was, how intense it was, etc!.

I applaud you in your efforts to study and become more articulate in your critiques!. I loved hydro's answer, though!

maWww@QuestionHome@Com

Read anything by Lewis Turco!. I don't know what might be published on the web, but his book, "Poetry, An Introduction Through Writing" is full of valuable information and lots of good exercises!. You may not be familiar with the "technical" terms of poetics, but I love the stuff you post!.Www@QuestionHome@Com

I have had the same thoughts!. The book mentioned by Elaine P!. is very good, especially for me, who never studied poetry before now!. It is very informative!. I had no idea how much there was to poetry!. also for the discussion of this book go to www!.poetsofmars!.com Enjoy!Www@QuestionHome@Com

HEYYYY THE BEST ADVICE I COULD GIVE YOU IS NOT TO TAKE ADVICE FROM PEOPLE THAT ARE A LEVEL ONE OR A LEVEL TWO,,,TECHNICALLY THERE STILL LEARNING ,,,,,,,THERE ARE FOUR ON HERE DEFINITELY DO NOT LISTEN # I-4-5-11 ,,,,THREE AND A HALF AND ABOVE USUALLY HAVE SOUND CRITIQUES ,,,JUST MY OPINION Www@QuestionHome@Com

I don`t know how to answer this!. Three of your comments have said it all!. Over, and over, and over again!. I got dizzy reading the same answer!. It sounds like they came from the same person!. But I don`t know much about poetry!. Just my opinion!.Www@QuestionHome@Com

Here is the link to the book the Poets of Mars are currently studying and discussing on their Forum:

http://www!.scribd!.com/doc/95633/Poetry
Www@QuestionHome@Com

go 1 life down your sreet
turn right at everything
head straight to your souls pull
left nothing behind of your hearts desires
carry on and when you see the rainbow
stop
and write

Www@QuestionHome@Com

A good question!. We are born with an inherent sense of harmony and disharmony, which some maintain and develop, and which others neglect!. Therefore we should have the ability to critique!.!.to some extent!. The key word in your question is 'properly', and I assume by this that you feel insecure regarding your abilities!. Poetry is certainly not just a case of putting down what you feel!. It is a combination of having something to say, and being able to communicate it appropriately (I think most poets would agree with that, and having read some of your work I asume you do too), and therefore it is usually a combination of art and craft!. Learning more about the craft will certainly give you better insight into the workings of a poem, and into the skills and intentions of other poets!. Why a poet has chosen to use a certain technique can lead to a better understanding of a poet's 'meaning'!. It will also open you to other options for structuring your own work, which can only be good!. If you want to learn more, I suggest simply looking up a few critical terms, and seeking evidence of them in your own poems!. You will soon get a grasp of it!. But remember!.!.all the terminology will only help you to express what you already sense poetically!. I studied poetry at University, and knew all the rules of the craft - but it was only when I wrote a little poem that felt 'good', and in curiosity took it apart, and saw the structures working beneath, that I really understood them!.
Going back to the beginning;) just as the best poetry is a combination of Art and Craft, so is the best criticism!.Www@QuestionHome@Com

If someone is good at WRITING poetry, it's because they know what makes a good poem!. Therefore, CRITIQUING a poem should not be difficult for them!.

Hmm, it seems my answer isn't good enough, going by the t/ds and your last edit, Sin!. Okay, if you're only at the learning stages, it's probably not a good idea to be critiquing other people's work unless/until you know what you're doing yourself!. "You can't give what you don't have" is an old saying, but a true one!. When you're supremely confident that you're ticking all the right boxes in your own work, and you know exactly how you're doing it, then you can turn your attention to the works of others!.

If you wanted to learn plumbing, who would you want to teach you!.!.!.the plumber or his new apprentice!?

Seek out An Honest Man!.!.!.you'll learn a lot from him!. (Although scantsanity's answer is a belter!) Further down is an 'answer' from someone who obviously considers others to be hard-of-hearing, and is renowned for his misuse of language, punctuation and grammar, and his inability to spell correctly!. This person does not write poetry himself and is scarcely qualified to judge the level of others in regard to their poetry!. In fact, in my opinion, his opinion is totally superfluous!. I'm sure you'll take this into account when assessing the viewpoint of a mere 'groupie' with no creative abilities at all!.Www@QuestionHome@Com

If someone is good at WRITING poetry, it's because they know what makes a good poem!. Therefore, CRITIQUING a poem should not be difficult for them!. You can always critique because poetry has no right or wrong!. So if you just write what is in your head then its good!. As long as you think so!. As for a site, well, there may be some for general poetry ideas and if you search for meters and technique then you should be on your way!.go one life down your street
turn right at everythinghead straight to your souls pull left nothing behind of your hearts desires carry on and when you see the rainbow
stop and writeWe are born with an inherent sense of harmony and disharmony, which some maintain and develop, and which others neglect!. Therefore we should have the ability to critique!.!.to some extent!. The key word in your question is 'porperly', and I assume by this that you feel insecure regarding your abilities!. Poetry is certainly not just a case of putting down what you feel!. It is a combination of having something to say, and being able to communicate it appropriately (I think most poets would agree with that, and having read some of your work I asume you do too), and therefore it is usually a combination of art and craft!. Learning more about the craft will certainly give you better insight into the workings of a poem, and into the skills and intentions of other poets!. Why a poet has chosen to use a certain technique can lead to a better understanding of a poet's 'meaning'!. It will also open you to other options for structuring your own work, which can only be good!. If you want to learn more, I suggest simply looking up a few critical terms, and seeking evidence of them in your own poems!. You will soon get a grasp of it!. But remember!.!.all the terminology will only help you to express what you already sense poetically!. I studied poetry at University, and knew all the rules of the craft - but it was only when I wrote a little poem that felt 'good', and in curiosity took it apart, and saw the structures working beneath, that I really understood them!.
Going back to the beginning;) just as the best poetry is a combination of Art and Craft, so is the best criticism!.Www@QuestionHome@Com