If virtue is the sole good of man?

Question:How is moral progress to be determined against these Stoic absloutes?

All who are not wise are fools, all who are not free are slaves, all who are not virtuous are vicious.

When are we wise, free and virtuous, and compared to what?

Best Answer - Chosen by Asker: How is moral progress to be determined against these Stoic absloutes?

All who are not wise are fools, all who are not free are slaves, all who are not virtuous are vicious.

When are we wise, free and virtuous, and compared to what?

I think that virtue is the sole good of other men.

Therefore, when my behavior is to share wisdom with other men, I am wise.

When I allow others to be free, I am free.

And when I act with virtue toward others, I am virtuous.

My belief is that progress is something that we can only achieve to a certain level and the thing we need to concern our self with is the balance of our actions in relation to how they effect others. Instead of the black and white way of viewing things as a stoic, it might be better to have a read of Aristotle's Nichomachean Ethics to get a balanced view of virtue in a way that is virtuous for the person who treats themself as they treat others.

"Absolute" is slang for "I'm too lazy to think through the permutations."

Life is endless shades of gray on a sliding scale.

I have to go now - my head hurts after that one.

I really don't know how often we have access to the best of all decisions. Too often, one's freedom is built on top of the slavery of others. Doesn't virtue require enforcement?

Wisdom, freedom and virtuous may not even agree with each other. What then?

That's often the flaw of sweeping statements taken out of context.

We are wise when we acknowledge the wisdom of others, even the most ignorant.
We are free when we allow others to have their freedom, to not covet ours.
And we are virtuous when we look at others and see ourselves.

We are wise when we are silent...ever watching , ever listening...we are free when we owe no pentence, (IRS not included) and we ask for none as well. We are virtuous when we suround ourselfs with those who share our loves our beliefs, and our dreams. Compared to the fools who hate all, and share nothing.

thats a tall order i think, we are wise when we can think for ourselves, we are free when the chains are broken, we are virtuous when we have proven to be so.

check this out >
http://www.escapefromwatchtower.com/stag...

What is your purpose of using the "Stoic absolutes" is my first question. Why is that your standard?

You make it sound as if those "absolutes" are unarguable, because you ask as if you mean "How (oh How)?"

If that isn't what you mean, then how do you mean "how"?

I think those "absolutes" are too exclusive of options. In modern English few men, educated or otherwise, are wise; and not all who are educated or otherwise but not wise are fools.

Transliteration from Stoic to English, with a few other translations inbetween may have something to do with that. The Stoics could never believe that all men are either or.

The second clause is completely true if "free" and "slave" are taken as absolute opposites. No problem there.

Why do they think the absolute opposite of virtue is viciousness? It is usually taken to be "vice."

Perhaps another transliteration problem.

Yes, virtue is the sole good of man, because only virtue is used to gain or to keep things of value, and goodness is of value, and we are wise when we know when and which virtue gains which value.

Other than that, what else can I say?

Unfortunately, a lot of people consider wise as having an education. Knowing your mind is wise, understanding the emptiness of all phenomena is wise, renouncing worldly things is wise, not being a slave to emotions is wise.
We are free when we come to know these things and to transcend worldly affairs and connect to our higher consciousness and through doing this we become virtuous because without purity the doors will never open.

"All who are not wise are fools. All who are not free are slaves. All who are not virtuous are vicious" is a pointless profundity for uninspired meditation. It merely is a parade of antonyms.

Harleigh Kyson Jr.