From Socialism to Communism?

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Question:

I hear some people talking about socialism leading to communism, like as in if the US gets socialized medicine it will lead down the slippery slope to communism!.

So to the history experts out there, have any countries actually drifted from socialism slowly into communism!? From what I know, most communist countries got that after bloody revolutions overthrew colonial rulers or monarchies!.Www@QuestionHome@Com

Best Answer - Chosen by Asker:

That socialised medicine would strengthen communists is something that Karl Marx might have believed 160 years ago!. Reality tells a very different story!.

Western European countries have had state controlled health systems (call it socialised medicine if you like) for about 60 years, and not one of them drifted towards communism as a result!.
In fact, the opposite happened: The provision of free education, social security and pensions, affordable medical treatment and the stricter application of the rule of law strengthened the existing political systems and weakened the communist movements!.

In Russia, the communists had taken power in 1917 from the Czar's totalitarian regime, at the time when poverty was extreme, and exploitation and abuse were commonplace!. The situation in China was similar in many ways!.

The Eastern European countries were forced into communism after the Second World War, when they were occupied by Soviet troups!.

The only countries that could still be called communist are North Corea and Cuba, but as has been mentioned here before, their systems are far from what the theory of communism actually states!.

China has over the last 25 years moved from a communist dictatorship to a corporate state, i!.e!. a fascist dictatorship, and this transition has been amazingly smooth!. China still calls itself communist, but it isn't!.Www@QuestionHome@Com

No, it has not happened!. The two are separate concepts, but are interrelated!. Socialism is an economic system where the government owns all means of production and resources so it can be distributed evenly to the population!. The concept of communism is similar except a true communist society has no government; the people are self governing and voluntarily live in equality and communion, and distribute resources evenly for the common good!. It was believed that the only way to break the old mentality of property and government was to implement a socialist economy to wean people away from the old mindset!. Over time, the population would return to what communist thinkers believed was the natural state of mankind and live in a communist society where each is provided what they need and each would happily contribute to the best of their abilities for the common good!. At that point, government would dissolve because it would no longer be needed!. While it is a nice thought, it never works because that line of thought assumes people's natural tendency is to be kind and unselfish, but the opposite seems to be true!.Www@QuestionHome@Com

To understand socialism and communism, one first has to understand the society we live in, Capitalism!. In capitalism, the means of production are privately owned!. That means land and all forces used to produce what society needs for its maintenance are owned by individuals!. This has in the past even included owning the laborers!. Capitalism is a class system -- or bourgeois dictatorship -- divided between the owners (bourgeoisie) and the producers, or workers, aka the proletariat!.

Under Socialism, the means of production are socially or collectively owned!. Sometimes the State is featured as the basis of collective ownership in the interest of the workers, society's majority!. Socialism is also a class society, where the workers rule the capitalists, and diminish them!. The State and the one-party system play the primary role in maintaining this dictatorship of the proletariat!.

Communists see socialism as a tempory condition!. After the socialist revolution has succeeded in wiping out the bourgeoisie or converting them to the use of the proletarian dictatorship, the State melts away and the Communist period begins!. That is a permanent, classless, stateless society!.

That is the Marxist theory of capitalism, socialism and communism!.Www@QuestionHome@Com

Ah, the Cold War rears its ugly head once again!. It's to be expected!.

Ok, first of all, socialism really only means that things are provided for all!. Helping the poor isn't generally considered a bad thing!. OTOH, Capitalism means "I've got mine; you've got yours!." That's also not a bad thing!. No one wants someone to walk through their house and help themselves to the kitchen because they don't feel like paying their own grocery bills!.

Now, you can look at socialism and capitalism as a sliding scale, with each at one end: socialism at the left end, of course!. Any healthy country has a mix of the two!. Even the US has some socialism: Social Security, the Post Office, VA benefits, highways and roads, ports, etc!.

Communism comes in two types!. Primitive communism is a group of people sharing whatever they have for the common good!. This is often found in out-of-the-way tribes where it's a survival technique!. also, some have advocated we do that as an ethical imerative!. The most famous of those advocates is probably Jesus himself!.

The other type is Marxist communism!. In its pure form it's never been tried, but derivitives (Leninism, Maoism, etc!.) have been!. Marx's tagline was "From each according to his ability, to each according to his need", whereas the derivitives (who had to contend with reality) had to, at best, change that to "From each according to his ability, to each according to his work"!.

The problem with Marxist communism isn't the idea!. The problem with it is that it doesn't WORK, in practice!. I hate to say that, but that's the bald-faced reality!.

So, to answer your question!. No, historically, countries don't start out "capitalist", and slowly drift inexorably to communism--unless you consider, say, Britain, communist!. Capitalist societies can adopt various measures that add bits of socialism, but that doesn't make them communist (except in the eyes of people who would call, say, Canada, "communist" because they provide their people free health care, for instance)!. You have to set out to really turn a society and economy on its head to be honestly called a communist!.Www@QuestionHome@Com